标题: 评海外的“恨赋” 译文，作者南朝梁文学家江淹 [打印本页]
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-11 19:01 标题: 评海外的“恨赋” 译文，作者南朝梁文学家江淹
海外的“恨赋” 译文太差，存心让原作者南朝梁文学家江淹死不瞑目，恨上加恨， 咬牙切齿，可逝者又能怎么样呢？
海外还附一个说明：
"說明﹕江淹的“恨賦”﹑“別賦”（附後）乃兩篇文學性極強的賦文。本人一向持
不入虎穴焉得虎子之翻譯姿態﹐就是要譯別人不敢譯之高難度作品。果不其然﹐網
上找不到第二人之翻譯。難道華人中竟無對手﹐一呈其水平歟﹖古來譯手皆寂寞。
可知華夏域中﹐盡多沽名釣譽之徒﹐而無真才實學之輩。可不嘆歟。余冀此輩之中﹐
激勵之下﹐或有知恥之人﹐奮起一譯﹐以符余望。“
这段话是他的自我检讨吗？ 如果是，他说自己是沽名钓誉之徒，不知廉耻，没有真才实学，那么 除这几句讲得好外， 译文真是不忍卒读。
我的上一个帖大家也看到我为读者翻译的老外诗人们对这个ID海外的诗词译文的评论， 真是惨不忍睹， 在这里： http://www.yidian.org/view-thread-23761.html
好，现在我们来看看ID为海外的“恨赋”译文，看看Ta是怎样糟蹋这位南朝梁文学家江淹的传世佳作：
（1 ) 首句Ta就理解错了。 首句“試望平原，蔓草縈骨，拱木斂魂。”
意思是指 “秋色连天，平原万里。这里是古战场的残迹。放眼望去，只有那缠绕着尸骨的蔓
草和那阴森的枯木。 它如同一座收敛魂魄的地狱，凄凉，萧索。 ”
由于这个ID海外没能理解原文的意思，Ta译成： Let me watch the battlefield plain: wild weeds entwining bones and trees before tombs gathering ghosts.
翻译太差，文法不通，不是英语句子，可以看出大概意思是：讓我看戰場平原︰ 野草纏繞骨頭和树在坟墓前。
原文没有“让我看”这个表达。原文是萧索，凄凉的情景描述。
如果译者一定要用Entwine 就得要用With
译者不明白“拱木” 的意思，所以没有把拱木译出，只简单地译成Trees
根据字典:
拱木
基本解释：
________________________________________
1.径围大如两臂合围的树。泛指大树。
2.《左传．僖公三十二年》:"尔何知?中寿，尔墓之木拱矣。"后因称墓旁之木为拱木。亦婉指已死
我试译： Under the autumn sky, it is a vast extended plain－－ the remnant of an ancient battlefield. Looking ahead, as far as I can see, all in my eyes are creeping weeds intricately entwining with bones and gloomy dead trees. As if a hell of convergence of souls, it feels so desolate and melancholy. （初稿）
(2) 第二句：“人生到此，天道寧論？于是僕本恨人，心驚不已。”
它的意思是：如果人生已经走到这一步，又怎能知晓天道安在？满目孤愁，心怀万般伤痛，脑海中仿佛又忆起随时间远去的亡灵。
海外的译文：At this stage of life, is it imperative to
talk of Providence? I am thus a born regretter, being stunned to no end.
I think of the ancients regretting of such death. （我看不明白Ta到底想说什么)
我试译： When your life reaches this stage, how can you still believe that there are really laws of nature existing out there? My heart aches for this sorrowful scene as if it calls to mind spirits that have faded away following the wheel of time . （初稿）
（待续）
海外的原译文：
Essay on Regretting
by Jiang Yan of South Dynasties
Let me watch the battlefield plain: wild weeds entwining bones and trees
before tombs gathering ghosts. At this stage of life, is it imperative to
talk of Providence? I am thus a born regretter, being stunned to no end.
I think of the ancients regretting of such death. As for Emperor of Qin holding
sword and lords marching westward. At last he conquered all the states under
heaven and united languages and measures. Mt. Hua became city wall and Purple
Abyss deep pond (moat). Although his ambition fulfilled, his wish by force
never ended. Just after he used turtle and crocodile as beams, he traveled
to the seaside to see the sun down. But once his soul left his body, his
palace hearse was pulled out (to his tomb) in the evening.
When King Zhao was captured, he was sent to Fangling. His heart throbbed
at dusk and his spirit rose at dawn at bidding farewell to his gorgeous
concubines and beautiful women and at losing his pompous golden coach and
jade chaise. As he was about to drink the wine served, his sorrow filled
his chest. He could never overcome his regret for thousand autumns and myriad
years.
As general Li surrendered to the northern tribe, his name was in disgrace
and he himself was wronged. He drew out his sword to strike at a pillar,
lamenting his own solitary shadow and ashamed of his lonely soul. His feelings
went out to his nation, but his heart remained in Goose Gate. He tore off
a piece of cloth to write a letter on it and tied it on the foot of a wild
goose. He vowed to return the favor of Han Dynasty. When morning dew came
all at once, what could be said while shaking hands?
When Concubine Ming left, she raised her head to Heaven and heaved a sigh.
The Purple Terrace was too far and Passes extended without an end. Soughing
winds suddenly arose and the sun hid in the west. Wild geese in Long were
few, flying, and clouds over Dai had little color, showing. She wanted to
look at the emperor, but how could she fulfill her wish? She would end her
life like withering weeds in the strange region.
As to Jingtong having given offense, he was dismissed from office and went
home. He shut himself up, no longer receiving guests. He closed his door,
and decided never to be at court again. He faced his wife and played with
children. He did not stand on ceremony before dukes and courtiers. He held
special views about literature and history. He harbored an ambition, but
nowhere to realize it. His regret had no end.
When Ji Kang was thrown into prison, he put on agitated airs. He drank
scummy wine at sunset and laid out the plain zither in the morning. The
autumn day was bleak and chilly. The floating clouds were dim and dark.
Although he had unusual will like brilliant afterglow, he got into the long
night without the sunrise.
There might be lonely courtiers shedding tears, unfilial sons being downhearted,
demoted officials roaming on the sea or exiled to cold Long area. Such
persons, once hearing sad winds rise, would weep blood soaking the gown.
They also experienced hardship and regret, and ended their lives for nothing
like sinking into smoke. As for horse hoof prints and coach traces overlapping
each other, and yellow dust whirling on the ground, and songs and music sounding
everywhere, all finished like smoke vanishing and fire extinguished, or bones
buried by springs underground.
Be it so! When autumn winds arise surprisingly, spring grass will wither;
but when autumn winds subside, spring grass revives. Gauze and satin will
no longer exist; ponds and houses will disappear; zithers and lutes will
become dust; mounds and graves will be leveled. There has been death since
time of yore. There's never without regret and wailing choked.
所有註解在此從略。
恨賦 （南朝）江淹
試望平原，蔓草縈骨，拱木斂魂。人生到此，天道寧論？于是僕本恨人，心驚不已。
直念古者，伏恨而死。 至如秦帝按劍，諸侯西馳。削平天下，同文共規，華山為城，
紫淵為池。雄圖既溢，武力未畢。方架黿鼉以為梁，巡海右以送日。一旦魂斷，宮
車晚出。 若乃趙王既虜，遷于房陵。薄暮心動，昧旦神興。別艷姬與美女，喪金輿
及玉乘。置酒欲飲，悲來填膺。千秋萬歲，為怨難勝。 至如李君降北，名辱身冤。
拔劍擊柱，吊影慚魂。情往上郡，心留雁門。裂帛系書，誓還漢恩。朝露溘至，握
手何言？ 若夫明妃去時，仰天太息。紫台稍遠，關山無極。搖風忽起，白日西匿。
隴雁少飛，代雲寡色。望君王兮何期？終蕪絕兮异域。 至乃敬通見抵，罷歸田里。
閉關卻掃，塞門不仕。左對孺人，顧弄稚子。脫略公卿，跌宕文史。 賚志沒地，長
怀無已。 及夫中散下獄，神气激揚。濁醪夕引，素琴晨張。秋日蕭縈，浮云無光。
郁青霞之奇意，入修夜之不晹。 或有孤臣危涕，孽子墜心。遷客海上，流戍隴陰，
此人但聞悲風汩起，血下沾衿。亦复含酸茹嘆，銷落湮沉。 若乃騎疊跡，車屯軌，
黃塵匝地，歌吹四起。無不煙斷火絕，閉骨泉里。 已矣哉！春草暮兮秋風驚，秋風
罷兮春草生。綺羅畢兮池館盡，琴瑟滅兮丘壟平。自古皆有死，莫不飲恨而吞聲。
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 19:19
entwine 可以是及物动词
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-11 19:36
Originally posted by 小草 at 2016-8-11 19:19:
entwine 可以是及物动词
thanks! Grammatically you are right. Just to emphasize on the scene that the creeping weeds entangled with the dead trees.
en·twine
(ĕn-twīn′)
v. en·twined, en·twin·ing, en·twines
v.tr.
To twine around or together: The ivy entwined the column.
v.intr.
To twine or twist together.
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 19:39
神气激揚 - put on "agitated" airs / why agitated?
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 19:54
There has been death since time of yore. ----- times or days of yore?
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 20:10
小曼同学，我提个建议哈，你最好避免 “我替（帮）某某改“ 这样之类的言辞。这样你的形象更完美。不要让任何人有借口和把柄。
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 20:19
Ok, what is the difference between unite languages and unify languages?
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 20:33
流戍隴陰 --- exiled to cold Long area / 这个 cold Long 估计一般老外读者不会明白，除非是汉学家。cold Long 中西结合
Long 龙 ／ 笼 ／ 垄 which is which? 特别是现在国人都强调要用 Long 替代 dragon, hmm, it seems somewhat misleading...
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 21:31
已矣哉 ---- be it so or so be it?
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 21:32
Be it so
Related to Be it so: ISO, sox, SOA, Sony
a phrase of supposition, equivalent to suppose it to be so; or of permission, signifying let it be so.
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 21:33
so be it
So be it.
This is the way it will be. If you insist on running off and marrying her, so be it. Only don't say I didn't warn you! Mary has decided that this is what she wants. So be it.
McGraw-Hill Dictionary of American Idioms and Phrasal Verbs. © 2002 by The McGraw-Hill Companies, Inc.
so be it
nothing can be done about this Start with the most important thing you need to do, and if nothing else gets done, so be it.
Cambridge Dictionary of American Idioms Copyright © Cambridge University Press 2003. Reproduced with permission.
so be it
Let it be so, I accept it as it is. For example, If you can't change the reservation, so be it; I'll travel on Monday. This phrase, often given as a translation of the Hebrew (and Greek and Latin) amen, has been employed in the current sense since about 1600.
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-11 21:42
多谢小草的善于提醒。 ：） 修改了。
很高兴和才高八斗，心胸豁达的小草交流， 受益匪浅。
小草的英语和翻译都是一级棒，远在我之上是我学习的榜样。
谢谢你！
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-11 22:03
已矣哉意思是罢了，算了，绝望词。
参考：http://pedia.cloud.edu.tw/Entry/Detail/?title=已矣
海外译成 be it so， means let it be so.但愿如此。不是原文的意思。
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Be+it+so
原文意思： 这一切都将近结束了，罢了！
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-11 22:12
soon it all will be gone.
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-11 23:23
as for emperor ....单独一句。
跟下一句 at last 什么关系？
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-11 23:33
Mt hua became city wall，典型中式英语，缺 一个冠词 a
to see the sun down --to see the sun come down
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-11 23:41
Without the sunrise
--- with no sunrise 不需the
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 23:46
Originally posted by Xiaoman at 2016-8-12 04:33 AM:
Mt hua became city wall，典型中式英语，缺 一个冠词 a
to see the sun down --to see the sun come down
Down can be a verb ), xiaoman, you need to make sure there is no room for any type of excuse.
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 23:49
In other words, you simply say check mate! That is it, the game is over. )
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-11 23:51
你要做到 一剑封喉！
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-12 03:46
Originally posted by Xiaoman at 2016-8-12 04:41 AM:
Without the sunrise
--- with no sunrise 不需the
赞同小曼同学！熟练应用小词和冠词一直是 non-native speakers 的一个关。我觉得海外逸士应该对此给出个交代，你为何要在此用冠词？
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-12 04:49
华山为城 ---- 这个城应该就是长城，the Great Wall, 而非一般的所谓的城墙吧？ city wall ?
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-12 05:37
Passes extended without an end--- an doesn't seem necessary, does it? The world without end
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-12 06:16
黃塵匝地，歌吹四起。無不煙斷火絕，閉骨泉里
海外译 and yellow dust whirling on the ground, and songs and music sounding
everywhere, all finished like smoke vanishing and fire extinguished, or bones
buried by springs underground. （可见译得他很痛苦，难受像便秘）
江淹的意思是： 黄烟滚滚翻腾着，哀歌从每个心灵深处的角落逐渐响起
血泪泣尽，流逝于时间，断送于黄沙。惟有大漠的孤烟消散了，惟有最后一匹骏马的白骨缓缓没入那幽咽的寒泉
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-12 06:27
歌吹四起，海外直译 songs and music sounding everywhere.
海外理解不了句子的涵义，什么歌？哀歌？怨曲还是欢乐颂Ode to joy？
主题是一个“恨”字，你必须围绕主题去理解原作的用词。
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-12 06:42
南鄉子 一剑封喉
暴雨怒通宵，秋晚狂風卷飄搖。 洗尽人间世俗尘， 蕭蕭。 劣跡斑斑亦全消。
我劍要出鞘，鬼魅魍魎無處逃。 天地正氣攔不住， 滔滔。 一把龍淵斬魔妖。
Heavily it rains throughout the night,
the crazy autumn winds blow so high.
Rain washes all dust off everything,
while winds are constantly howling.
All bad stains are being bleached,
I pull out my sword from the sheath:
all devils have nowhere to run away,
nothing can block the righteous way.
Justice soars up to the awesome sky,
I'll kill them with my Longyuan knife.
Nov.25， 2015
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-12 07:02
多谢小草大侠拔刀相助，
有事先退了。 后会有期！
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-12 07:41
Originally posted by Xiaoman at 2016-8-12 11:42 AM:
南鄉子 一剑封喉
暴雨怒通宵，秋晚狂風卷飄搖。 洗尽人间世俗尘， 蕭蕭。 劣跡斑斑亦全消。
我劍要出鞘，鬼魅魍魎無處逃。 天地正氣攔不住， 滔滔。 一把龍淵斬魔妖。
Heavily it rains throughout..
Justice soars up to the awesome sky,
I'll kill them with my Longyuan knife.
---------------------
Into the mighty sky Justice has soared
Evils are chopped under my Longyuan sword
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-12 08:29
Originally posted by 小草 at 2016-8-12 07:41:
Justice soars up to the awesome sky,
I'll kill them with my Longyuan knife.
---------------------
Into the mighty sky Justice has soared
Evils are chopped under my Longyuan sword
好！
小草改得不错。
我原是想能主动语态的尽量主动。 ：） 谢谢你！
作者: 海外逸士 时间: 2016-8-12 09:48
要試譯一篇高深的古文，即使看不懂，只要有別人譯過，拿來修修改改，就能應付。但亂加意思，語句不到位，又有什麼意思。要表示有高水平，自己獨立翻譯以前沒人譯過的古文，就必定是高水平。我以前一直建議你們三位翻譯 王勃的"滕王閣序"。你們中沒有一個有勇氣去翻譯的。但又老是厚顏無恥吹噓自己水平高。高水平人就這麼不敢接受挑戰?
新來的小草 女士/先生 (究竟是女士還是先生? 確定了以後容易稱呼。) 就比你的水平高。很希望能讀到小草 女士/先生的精彩譯稿或原創英文。謝謝。
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-12 09:53
挑拨我与两位教授被识破，转而挑拨我和小草兄。哈哈哈哈哈哈！ ：）
各位观众看乐了。 哈哈 ！ ：） 这个80多的grandpa是多么的有能耐。上窜下跳，急的。悠着点。再想想别的？比喻男女关系，女女关系？还是。。。帮你开发思路。
伊甸开心果小贝壳为大家报道
作者: 海外逸士 时间: 2016-8-12 10:14
我有200多首，篇 翻譯，還有原創英文詩歌散文，你都拿過來，夠你忙的。如果你能都讀一遍，對你不無幫助。
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-12 10:37
Originally posted by 海外逸士 at 2016-8-12 10:14:
我有200多首，篇 翻譯，還有原創英文詩歌散文，你都拿過來，夠你忙的。如果你能都讀一遍，對你不無幫助。
你写得太烂。反面教材，不需要多。我没有义务帮你。
作者: 海外逸士 时间: 2016-8-12 12:22
我說的是事實。不像你心眼多，心思惡毒，對我下了幾次套。我本來想委曲求全，消消你的氣，以便和解。誰知你不依不饒，糾纏不休。別以為我真的怕你。我現在準備奉陪到最後一口氣。
你不能自己認識自己，我幫你認識一下。你既沒經過嚴格的語言訓練，語法知識很少，慣用法對你沒概念，更別說一些特別用法。看到都以為有問題。不知道是你本身知識貧乏問題。再說你要罵就罵吧。你只能老是重複以前罵過的話，你這水平連罵人都不能創新。談什麼搞學問。你別以為別的論壇上有人誇你兩句，是不想跟你吵架。我說他們的前車之鑒。
其實我拿王勃的文章挑戰你們，不包括你。你這種中文水平肯定看不懂。你根本沒有資格列入被挑戰之名單。不過，那兩個懦夫估計也不敢應戰。他們的中英文水平我都了解。他們只會躲在陰暗的角落裡，在你跟我吵架時，放個冷箭。也不見他們在這個網站上貼出過有質量的作品。要知道攻擊別人不說明自己水平好。水平是要拿自己的作品來說明的。
我的作品也可能存在某些問題，但你們講的都是你們知識貧乏的關係。你們好好在我的作品裡找一找，找出真正的問題，我還要謝謝你們。費心了。我自己沒時間找。所以想利用你們要批評我的急躁心情。慢慢找吧。總能找到的。先謝了。
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-12 14:28
Originally posted by 小草 at 2016-8-12 12:41 PM:
Justice soars up to the awesome sky,
I'll kill them with my Longyuan knife.
---------------------
Into the mighty sky Justice has soared
I chop evils under my Longyuan sword
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-12 14:31
Originally posted by Xiaoman at 2016-8-12 01:29 PM:
好！
小草改得不错。
我原是想能主动语态的尽量主动。 ：） 谢谢你！
你说的对。我又改了一下，是不是更好些？
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-12 14:52
Originally posted by 海外逸士 at 2016-8-12 05:22 PM:
我說的是事實。不像你心眼多，心思惡毒，對我下了幾次套。我本來想委曲求全，消消你的氣，以便和解。誰知你不依不饒，糾纏不休。別以為我真的怕你。我現在準備奉陪到最後一口氣。
你不能自己認識自己，我幫你認識..
心平气和交流难道不好吗？大家都不是 native speakers, 但也都是英文爱好者和使用者，别说我们这些人常犯错，就是老美前总统小布什也会犯这错那错，所以我认为大家不要意气用事，好好探讨，有错就改，有精彩处一起来捧场。你是教授，又是前辈，气量要大些。学而不厌，诲人不倦。
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-12 14:56
Originally posted by 海外逸士 at 2016-8-12 05:22 PM:
我說的是事實。不像你心眼多，心思惡毒，對我下了幾次套。我本來想委曲求全，消消你的氣，以便和解。誰知你不依不饒，糾纏不休。別以為我真的怕你。我現在準備奉陪到最後一口氣。
你不能自己認識自己，我幫你認識..
中国的那些典籍基本上都已被翻译过了，包括王勃的这篇序。
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-12 15:16
哈哈哈！：）“我以前一直建議你們三位翻譯 王勃的"滕王閣序"。”
设圈套也那么低级， 你又露馅了。 ：） 我们只对评论有兴趣。 偶尔有心情就教教你基本文法。
作者: Xiaoman 时间: 2016-8-12 16:08
Originally posted by 小草 at 2016-8-12 14:52:
心平气和交流难道不好吗？大家都不是 native speakers, 但也都是英文爱好者和使用者，别说我们这些人常犯错，就是老美前总统小布什也会犯这错那错，所以我认为大家不要意气用事，好好探讨，有错就改，有精彩处..
我一开始上网他就盯上我，攻击我，贬损我， 美语坛数千读者见证。
这样的“教授” 真是奇葩。 ：）
因为都译得比他好，所以众翻译家， 包括无名小辈，譬如我，备受此ID恶毒攻击，在所难免。 ：）
作者: 小草 时间: 2016-8-12 21:21
浊醪 - 被译为 scummy wine ? 有这样的表达吗？浊醪 的意思大家都懂，那么如何英译？我觉得不能按原文字面意思来译。浊醪就是 low quality wine, another expression is rough wine, 既然有 fine, 那么就会有反义词。我觉得rough wine 是西方人能懂和理解的表达。 rough wine is not palatable at all due to its poor quality. 我认为 scummy may mislead readers ...这个大家可以探讨一下。
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